Transcript: PODCAST INTERVIEW: Predator Flies and Sparkle Boats: Steve Maldonado's Journey

Marvin Cash: Hey, folks, it's Marvin Cash, the host of the articulate Fly. On this episode, I'm joined by my friend and tire, Steve Maldonado. You may know him by one of his aliases, Skeeter or Johnny Lunchmeat. Steve and I discuss his sparkle boat days and his ascent down the slippery slope of fly fishing, and we take a deep dive into tying predator flies. I think you're going to enjoy this one. But before we get to the interview, just a couple of housekeeping items. If you like the podcast, please tell a friend and please subscribe and leave us a rating review in the podcatcher of your choice. It really helps us out. And a shout out to our sponsor, Trout Routes. I've known Zach and the team at Trout Routes almost before Zach had a team at Trout Routes. We all know streams are getting crowded, and chances are you're not the only one at your local access point. Get away from the crowds and busy gravel lots by using Trout Routes Pro, with over 350,000 access points mapped across 50,000 trout streams and much more, trout routes has all the data you need to help you find angling opportunities that others will overlook. Up your game and download the app today. Use code artfly20. All one word artfly20 for 20% off your Trout Routes Pro membership at maps.troutroutes.com. Now onto our interview. Well, Steve, welcome to The Articulate Fly.

Steve Maldonado: Thank you, Marvin. Glad to be here.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, I'm super looking forward to our conversation and, we like to start all of our interviews by asking our guests to share their earliest fishing memory.

Steve Maldonado: My earliest fishing memory? Well, I grew up in the valley here in Southeastern Colorado, uh, probably about a mile from the Arkansas River. My mom still lives in the same house that I grew up in, which is where I'm sitting right now. And, uh, earliest I can remember is, uh, my dad, uh, and I going out to, uh, John Martin Reservoir. Oh, I was probably six or seven years old uh, nothing fancy, spinning rods, worms we dug up from around my dad's horse corrals. Did a lot of cowboying. And, uh, I've been obsessed with it ever since. Just fishing and hunting with my dad. Uh, he was hardcore at it and never fly fish. Just, um, pitched them worms in a spinning rod, but he'd catch a bunch of fish.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And, so I have to ask you, since you're with your mom, what's for dinner tonight?

Steve Maldonado: Uh, probably green chili and homemade tortillas and mexican rice. And the stuff I grew up eating.

Marvin Cash: Wish I was there. That, that uh, sounds horrible, but, you know, one of the things I know, like, I know a lot of people know that you, you were a Marine. A lot of people know that you're a mechanic for Southwest. And I think even a lot of people know that you're a uh, you know, you were a high school wrestler. But I bet a lot of people don't know that, uh, before they found you in the fly fishing world, you were a sparkle boat guy.

Steve Maldonado: I was, I was, I was a, I was hardcore on the tournament trail.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. So that was, I guess you started out with Southwest in Texas. Is that kind of when you were fishing competitively for bass?

Steve Maldonado: Yeah. And it actually all started, uh, that got me into the bass deal was when I was in the Marine Corps, uh, was North Carolina stationed there. And I met, which ended up being my best friend. Matter of fact, when he retired, I got him hired at Southwest and his dad was a, uh, tournament bass fisherman back in the Bill Dance and Roland Martin days. And he was from, uh, uh, Port St. Lucie, Florida, fished, I mean, as a pro on the St. John's River and all that. So Sean, you know, had a dad that was actually, you know, on the bass tour. And he, you know, he showed me everything that uh, I needed to know in North Carolina. We were there for three years, bought a John Boat together and rented a motor on base and, and we just fished all over Havelock and all the rivers there and got uh, out and went to Texas and started uh, fishing a lot and uh, started uh, winning some tournaments and got picked up. I was fishing team, uh, tournaments on bass champs, Bud Light Trail, uh, in Texas for a bunch of years. I was there for 20 something years. Uh, I lived, uh, probably 15 minutes from lake, world famous lake fork, uh, if, uh, anybody knows about, you know, anything about bass fishing, uh, out of the top 50 bass ever caught in the United States, I think like 38 of them come from this lake. Um, and uh, I was, you know, ended up fishing these tournaments and did really well and, and uh, my partner, Sean Burris was an amazing angler and, and uh, you know, we were runner up for angler of the year several times. And, you know, I ended up getting sponsored by Denali Rods and, and uh, p line and Shimano. And, you know, it was uh, uh, ended uh, up running the boat for RH Landing. They got me the boat. All I had to do was fish out of it. I had a 21ft Legend 211 Alpha or 250 Mercury Pro excess and power poles and HDs touchscreens. And it's like anything I wanted, I just asked for it. But I was doing well enough where I could do this.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, that's, uh. That makes it a whole lot easier to buy the truck to pull the boat. Right?

Steve Maldonado: Exactly. It's, uh. And, you know, it all ended when I moved to Colorado. And it was kind of a, it was like almost a meant to be deal, because, uh, I was kind of looking into what was going on in Colorado, living in Denver, you know, working at DIA, I would have to drive to Pueblo, which is lengthy, which, you know, when you're a bachelor, it really don't matter. But kind of, uh, you know, they have some different, different rules here, like no wake lakes and stuff like that. Well, you know, uh, you got a 250 on there. You're waking before you get it on plane. And. And, uh, uh, it's almost, uh, kind of meant to be, because when I got rid of all that stuff before I came up here, I told Phil right off the bat, I said, had I not done that, I said I would never met you. I mean, back by me, you probably would be talking right now, because I said I would never have been fly fishing.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, that's neat. And so, for folks that don't know, that is Phil "Ratstink" Iwane. And so, uh, that means you get to officially keep Skeeter if we ever get that project off the ground.

Steve Maldonado: Yeah.

Marvin Cash: Uh, uh. So, so how did you kind of get into fly fishing? You know, I guess, you know, you move, you're not going to competitively bass angle anymore, you know. When did you get the edge?

Steve Maldonado: Well, actually, I was still working for Southwest, living in East Texas, and one of my great friends down there, J.B. Jarvis, we were running buddies down there, and, and, uh, uh, he said, hey, man, let's go to Beaver's Band, and let's go try some fly fishing. I said, where's that at? And, uh, we went up there and got some, uh, from the Bargain Cave, if everybody remembers that at Cabela's. We went and got some old junk stuff over there. I don't even know what kind of rods or reels is, we had. We got, uh, tried tying our own flies, and, uh, went up there. Well, it's a bunch of stalkers. And, uh, then you just, I mean, you throw a cigarette butt out there, they'll eat it. But, uh, we were throwing these ugly flies that we were tying a man. We thought we were the cat's meow. And, uh, that was around 2009. And, uh, we went up there once, and we were hooked on it. We had no clue what we were doing at all. But these stalker fish were, were eaten, and we kept going back, uh, more and more, and it's just kind of what, you know, started it. Like I said, I had no clue what I was doing.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, that's neat. And, of course, it's lucky for you. I mean, I think the, you know, kind of The Denver metro area is one of the trout fishiest places in the country in terms of the resource and the shops and all that sort of stuff. Right?

Steve Maldonado: It is. It is. It's. It's phenomenal. It's just absolutely phenomenal. The, There's so many options, uh, you never even have to, you know, I mean, you kind of have to plan, uh, where you're going to go, because it just, it just gets in your head, and you're like, wow, there's so many places I could go.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And, and, so, you know, that, I guess that's about 15 years ago, you know, who are some of the folks that have, uh, mentored you on your fly fishing journey, and what have they taught you?

Steve Maldonado: Without a doubt, Phil, Phil Iwane, uh, is, uh, number one on the list, uh, of. That was a kind of a meant to be deal, too. I mean, moved, um, up here with Southwest, uh, and I seen a big billboard going back home, uh, where I was staying, actually sold my house in Texas and, uh, said fly fishing show. And I'm thinking, oh, wow, to check that out. And it was at the Denver Mart. Didn't know nothing about it. Went there on a Saturday, and there was a jillion people. And I got my ticket, and I walked around, and I'm just looking around. This place is huge. And Tammy, my wife, says it was meant to be. I said, because I could have went straight. I could have walked left, and I ended up going right. I seen a wall with people sitting against the wall, and they were. I was like, man, these guys are tying flies. And, I walked around the corner, and, uh, there was one guy that had just a bubble of people around. You can't even see the guy. And I was kind of standing up, you know, kind of short, like the Hobbit. And I, uh, was trying to see who this guy was, and I'm thinking, there's no way I'm going to get up there. So I, I walked to the end, and for some reason, instead of just keep on going, I turned around, and a, uh, little, um, bubble of people was dispersing. I'm like, I want to walk back here because obviously this guy's somebody, because there's a ton of people around this guy. And I walked by and I kind of peeked at him. And, uh, uh, he, he does the same thing. Uh, uh, like Jimmy Houston told people we want to, you know, something that catches more fish goes, hey. He goes, you want me to show you a fly that'll catch a bunch of fish. And I'm like, sure. And, uh, we've been best friends ever since. He asked, uh, me where I worked, and I told him I just moved here. Did, you know, did you fly fish? And he, I remember him saying, well, do you tie? And I said, not like that. And, uh, I said, I'm pretty horrible at it. Uh, he's probably, you know, one of my biggest mentors that showed me everything about nymphing and the small flies and the mending and the, you know, everything. That's the streamer game for me came later. That was kind of my own deals. Another, um, one is Rick Takahashi. Uh, Rick taught me so much about tying, making stuff perfect. Uh, and he's such a humble guy. And that humbleness is really rubbed off on me. Uh, you know, as a, as a bass, bass guy, you could really be kind of a smarty pants. And, uh, that's way different than any of the guys that I know now. Um, but there's a whole array of them. Scott Stisser, he's probably one of the best tires I've ever been around. Uh, he taught me so much about just making, uh, flies perfect. He does them Atlantic Salmon Flies and just watching him and him explaining how he does stuff and kind of taking me under his wing and explaining just how perfect you have to make these things. And it's, uh, over time and talking to these guys, um, it's kind of cool when I could tie 20 flies and I can have three guys that can really tie in front of me, watching me, and I can throw those 20 flies up in the air and let them hit the table and they won't know which one I tied first and which one I tied less because they look exactly the same. That's, that's, to me, is what these guys have done for me.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, that's super neat. And, so how long ago was it that you met Phil?

Steve Maldonado: Uh, this will be the 11th year, uh, that I met Phil. I've been here at DIA for eleven years. So, yeah, it's been just that eleven years.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. It's interesting. I can remember, um, going to the Denver Fly Fishing Show, you know, gosh, was probably, I don't know, three or four years before COVID uh, when it was still at the mart. And, uh, that was a neat place. And, uh, I was always super impressed because you could get a Bloody Mary first thing in the morning and walk the show.

Steve Maldonado: Oh, they were so good.

Marvin Cash: I will say Robert, uh, at The Gaylord makes great Bloody Mary's, too. So, folks, if you're at the Denver fly fishing show that's coming year, look for Robert. And, uh, tell him Marvin, uh, said to make a Bloody Mary for you, and he'll hook you up. Uh, so, so it's interesting, too, right? So, you know, you've got this kind of, you know, conventional background, come back to Colorado. But I know you chase a lot of stuff on the fly now.

Steve Maldonado: Yeah.

Marvin Cash: And, so I was kind of curious, you know, what's your favorite species to chase on the fly?

Steve Maldonado: Uh, like, on the fly period?

Marvin Cash: Uh, yeah, on the fly period. And if you need to, I'll give you two, because I feel generous this evening.

Steve Maldonado: Uh, my number one is tarpon, hands down is my number one is fishing for tarpon. Uh, of course, the next would be, you know, hard to beat, you know, just some big old browns. It's, uh, you know, and they're right up there with carp. Carp, to me, are just so fun, but, but, yeah, it's, uh, I'm obsessed with the tarpon fishing. I go quite a bit every June with a friend of mine that guides down there, and it's just, uh, that's got me, uh, I don't know. It's got me whack over them. Okay.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, it's kind of crazy. It's kind of. I would say that's probably one of the apex site, uh, fishing experiences you can have, because I can't think of a bigger fish that, uh, uh, you know, people are pursuing on the fly that you get to watch eat like that, right?

Steve Maldonado: Oh, yeah, yeah. It's, uh, and I think this, uh, uh, June, I jumped, uh, uh, well, I got some to the boat, but, uh, uh, it was 24 that I got in a week, period. It was insane.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. That's good, clean living, Steve.

Steve Maldonado: Oh, yeah.

Marvin Cash: So, in terms of, like, uh, trout places in Colorado, do you have a favorite river you like to fish?

Steve Maldonado: The Eagle. It's my favorite.

Marvin Cash: And; what makes it special for you?

Steve Maldonado: It's just, uh, uh, well, it's kind of special because Rim Chung goes there. Me and Phil and Rim go fish there a lot. And, uh, uh, that's another guy that's just one of my favorite guys to be around. He's so humble, and he's so patient. He's taught me just patience. And he's, he's so funny. Him and Phil get after it like, uh, uh, oh, like grumpy, your old man. That's uh, like the odd couple, Walter Matthew and Jack Lemmon. It's so funny the way they tease each other. But I go to the eagle because, uh, of that, they like to fish a lot. And it just turned into be one of my, my favorite rivers. There's so many good places to fish there. Uh, you don't have to drive, look very far. Just, there's a lot of fish in that river.

Marvin Cash: Ah, very, very neat. And you know, it sounded like you kind of were bitten by the fly tying bug at the same time you started became fly fishing curious. But was it really, you know, meeting Phil, say, 10, 11 years ago, that kind of made you decide that you really wanted to get serious about it?

Steve Maldonado: It was, it was, uh, you know, like I said, I started it, you know, in zero nine with my buddy J.B. when we started going to Oklahoma. But honestly, it's uh, uh, you know, when I met Phil, that's, that's when my life changed forever. It was, it was special.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, that's pretty neat. And so, do you remember the, your first vise and the first fly you tied on it?

Steve Maldonado: Oh, yeah, it's uh, uh, an HMH. Got it out at uh, the Bargain Cave once again in Texas. And my first fly was a really ugly hare's ear. And a matter of fact, I still have that original fly, uh, you know, and a couple other originals because Tammy said, you know, keep your fly. She goes, you might get better at this. She goes, that one's kind of ugly. She goes, but you'll always be able to look at your first fly. And uh, now it's uh, I have that one in the shadow box and then some of my uncle flies. I'm like, wow.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. Which is, I mean, it's pretty cool process to kind of get there in ten years. I mean, a lot of people, you know, quote, tie their entire lives and never, you know, really make a lot of progress, right?

Steve Maldonado: Mm. Mhm. Hmm.

Marvin Cash: And, so what do you tie on today?

Steve Maldonado: Uh, you know, as I got better, uh, I was, uh, Don talked to me from, uh, Regal at one of the shows. And uh, I got picked up by Regal. And Don has been good to me. And that's, that's probably been, oh, maybe eight years, uh, that I've been on a Regal. And uh, he's such a great guy. That whole, that whole Regal family is uh, is awesome. And, you know, the streamers that I tie, uh, you know, it's, it's, uh. I'll never change vices. I'll never even look at nothing. And and I've been, uh, you know, approached by all the big guns and, and Renzetti and all them, and I tell them no, just, uh, I'm not even interested. It's, uh, you know, Don's real good to me. And, uh, I really like the Regal for. For my style of tie in.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And is it the, uh, is it basically the jaw mechanism and how tightly it clamps those big hooks? Is that kind of what you like about the regal?

Steve Maldonado: Yeah, it's just a. Pull the handle, let it go. And the hooks in there, there's no knob adjusting or, no, you know, none of the stuff. It's, um, you know, and I tie big flies. And if I need some 24s, I'll just get them from Phil.

Marvin Cash: You'll have that little, uh, that little, uh, drug dealer Ziploc bag that he carries with him.

Steve Maldonado: Yeah.

Marvin Cash: Um, and, uh, he'll, he'll set you up, uh, for sure.

Steve Maldonado: Exactly.

Marvin Cash: The, um. That's funny. And so, you know, I know you mentioned Scott Stisser and Rick Takahashi and Phil, but, you know, uh, you know, those guys are, you know, to me, they're kind of, I mean, Scott, not. Not really, because he does a salmon fly thing, but, like, you know, Rick and Phil are, to me, are like, you know, mountain west fly tires. Right? But.

Steve Maldonado: Oh, yeah.

Marvin Cash: But you're, you know, when I think of you, and I know you've got, you know, trout, you know, buggy trout patterns with Umpqua, but I think of you as a predator dude. Right? And so, you know, who are some of the tires that you kind of follow, you know, on that predator fly front?

Steve Maldonado: Oh, I mean, that's such an easy list for me. It's, of course, one of my friends, Kelly Gallup, uh, Blaine Chocolate, of course. Uh, but that whole group, uh, Russ Madden, Strollis, you know, Alex Lufka, Chad Johnson Schmidt, um, um, on that end. And, uh, you know, I tie with all those guys at the streamer love test. Steve Dally is another one. Uh, just. How can you not follow these guys? I mean, it's just meat greatness is what I call them.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, dude, it's, uh. All those guys are kind of crazy. It's kind of funny. As you were kind of ticking through the names, I was lucky, you know, some of the guys that travel more, I've been able to kind of spend time with. But, I mean, a ton of those guys were up at, uh, Schultzy's event at Bob in the Hood.

Steve Maldonado: Yeah, yeah, it's a, uh, I was on the back burner for that. I'm hoping I get in this year. I was, I was late getting, um, you know, I was, um, um, just there. I was waiting for somebody to drop out, and I would have got in. Hopefully I get in there this year.

Marvin Cash: Well, fingers crossed. Uh, it's a fun time. And, dude, that is, you know, folks, if you are about predator streamers, that is an insanely awesome event. It's, uh, you know, it's not huge. You get to spend time with everybody. It's a lot of fun. The culture at Schultz Outfitters is a great culture. And, you know, they, you know, it's not just fly. They do gear, too. And, uh, just a super, super great kind of old school way a fly shop should run. And, you know, Steve, one of the things I'm always interested about, you know, when you get, you know, fly designers as opposed to fly tires, right. Is, you know, tell me a little bit about kind of your design philosophy, uh, you know, for predator flies and kind of what you think it takes to make an effective predator fly.

Steve Maldonado: Uh, my philosophy on that, I mean, it really, uh, uh, about, like, my whole thing with my tying style now. I mean, uh, my predator stuff goes back to my fishing the dash days. And when I really started to think about doing this, uh, I was thinking if I can make a fly mimic a fluke or jerk bait, which is my style of retrieving, uh, I would have something. So, I mean, that was my whole process, you know, when I sit at the bench, uh, um, and I mean, you know, the head, the tail and the articulation, uh, um, all that to me, plays. I mean, it plays a lot, uh, into the end of the fly. Um, but, you know, being on the bass tour, I mean, it's. I mean, if I threw a fluke out there and I just reeled it in, I wouldn't get nothing. It's to me, it's all about the retrieve. It's. It's really getting that fly to make it do stuff. Um, um, it's kind of hard to explain for guys that don't gear fish. I mean, it's, um, real funny because I have people look at me when I'm. When I'm, uh, streamer fishing, because, uh, it's just a whole different thing. It's the people that do the. And I mean, no, no offense, with the way people do stuff. But I mean, the, the strip strip. Stop. Strip, strip strip. Yeah. That's not even in my vocabulary. It's, it's all like fishing a jerk bait. You want to make that fly move with your rod, not with your line. And all you're doing with your line is just taking up slack. If you can pop that fly and make it move with your rod tip and not even mess with the line, then you're going to, you're going to, you're going to start catching a bunch of fish, and that's when you, you know, make fish bite, uh, uh, that really don't want to bite. Uh, uh. But I put all that in my, my, you know, my predator fly kind of deal. So to me, it's just, uh, uh, it always reflects to my bass days and how my patterns are going to react, you know, with my style of, you know, retrieving, uh, you know, whether it's in a, you know, current slack water, which I love to fish slack, uh, water for big trout with a lot of people in the drift boat will just zip right by it and, uh, zip right by some of the biggest fish that are around. Um, so I put a lot of hours of testing into these flies just, uh, to see if they'll retrieve like I want them to look. And I do a lot of on the, you know, whatever you call it on the bank tuning and the drift boat tuning. I mean, sometimes I'll, I'll hack them down to nothing.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. I mean, and so, so for people that know, like, if they've watched, you know, conventional guys fish, I mean, I can see you basically retrieving line and pumping the rod tip, right?

Steve Maldonado: Yes, yes. And, uh, really, it's, uh, that's all you're doing? I'm, I'm just holding that rod tip down and I'm pumping that rod tip. And, if you see my hand coming back, it has nothing to do with moving that fly. It's just getting the slack out of the way so I can keep that line tight to the fly. And, you know, I, I go back to, you know, um, one of the quotes in Kelly Galloup, you know, um, like I said it to me, it goes to the retrieve. But, you know, Kelly always said, you know, fish aren't looking to see how many things are wrong with your fly. They're looking to see how many things are right with your fly. But in the end, it's. The retrieve is what makes it effective.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And so with that pump, you're basically what you're getting is you're getting a left right, darting, but you're also getting kind of that kill where kind of the tail kind of crumples over the head.

Steve Maldonado: Yeah, yeah, exactly. So I'm basically trying to walk the dog underwater, and I'll pop, pop, pop, and I'll kill it, and then pop, pop, and I'll kill it. And then usually it'll, that fish will come, and you'll see them come, and you'll pop, pop, pop, and they're interested. And it's not like a tarpon. When you miss, you miss a strip. They're gone. Uh, they'll see that thing start fluttering like it's wounded. And as soon as you give it another pop, pop, they, they can't stop. They just eat it. It's, uh, pretty incredible.

Marvin Cash: It's like Doritos.

Steve Maldonado: Yeah.

Marvin Cash: But it's interesting. So, if you are not, um, animating the fly by stripping, does that mean that you're getting the swim action that you want, probably not with a lot of articulations and probably with more of a waiting and kind of head design in the fly?

Steve Maldonado: Yeah, it's really the head design to, uh, me, that makes a, a huge difference. Uh, when I do the heads, and I told people this when I do all my, my tying demos and just in general, um, if you watch my videos, when I put the eyes on, uh, I want them eyes just sticking out, um, where they're almost goofy looking. When you look at the fly from the front, the worst thing you could do to me, I mean, that I've noticed people put eyes on, they squeeze them together, and it just, it just kills the action of the fly. Uh, um, the way I put my eyes on makes, uh, my jungle junkie. I mean, you can tie one that's white where you can do it clear water, and just pop it, pop it, pop it. And it's basically just, just zigzagging back and forth underwater like a, like a zero spook on top, but it's doing it under the water. Uh, and I've tried it all kinds of different ways here in this, you know, evergreen lake that's clear as a bell. And I've squeezed the eyes a little bit, squeezed down a little bit more, and you get to a point where that thing just goes sideways. And, I mean, it's just, uh, uh, um, it's, uh, you know, you know, mate will sell the fishermen, but it won't catch no fish.

Steve Maldonado: I think it was the sh. It's. It's uh. That fly is just strictly a little bit of bucktail and American Tied Flies. Aaron Letera makes this uh, magnum dub and uh. It's just longer than the short, Seniors won't do it. I mean there's nothing wrong with the laser dub.

Marvin Cash: Uh.

Steve Maldonado: I don't ever use it. It's too short for streamers. For big streamers. It's just uh. It doesn't do right. And you know you could pile it on and pile it on and then you know you're really in a mess because your. Your flies don't work right. But it's uh. Uh. It's all about the head uh, that makes this thing. And the. And the way you put the eyes on. If uh, you squeeze the eyes whatsoever, it just uh. It doesn't work. And you know I got a lot of pics of my flies facing you and the eyes are really flared out sideways and. And uh. Uh. It's just the way the hydraulic works and the water push. Uh. It's pretty phenomenal. Um. The way the hydraulic uh. Uh, bush affects the way that fly just pops from side to side and it does it repeatedly and it never tilts to one side or the other. It just stays uh. It just stays straight and um, man, they sure come and get it.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. It sounds like you need a new, uh, sticker when you're tying next show season in 2025 that says, don't squeeze the eyes.

Steve Maldonado: Yeah. I've had people come over there. When I put it on my little clip and set it there, first thing they do is they pick it up and they squeeze the eyes. And I tell them, I said, you can have that. Really? And I'm like, well, yeah. And then they walk up like, well, that ain't gonna work.

Marvin Cash: So. So was the jungle junkie the first pattern that Umpqua feather merchants picked up from you?

Steve Maldonado: It was, it was the first one, uh, uh, that they picked up. And it was, uh, yeah, and it was a different name. I designed it for a pike fly because I, you know, I do love to pike fish. And, you know, I do it here. I do it game. My wife's from Michigan, I pike fish a lot. And, uh, it was a pike fly, hands down. I mean, that was. No, no joking around. Uh, and when I went there to Umpqua to turn it in, uh, that's when Dave, uh, the late Dave Student was there. And, and, man, it was, he tough. It was, uh, he looked at it and, uh, he liked it immediately. I mean, usually they would do the waiting period and the whole thing. I mean, they didn't just pick it up, like instantly. But when he, when I found out that the committee picked it up, uh, he called me, and, uh, I went in there to see him and, and I had so much respect for him. It just, uh, it was just, he just seemed like the guy you didn't want to play with. And I. He said, Steve, he goes, we're going to pick up your fly. Um, but, uh, I want to change the name on it. I said, I don't care what you call it. You put it your catalog, you call whatever you want. And, uh, he, um, said, we're going to try it as a South America fly. He goes, I think it'll, uh, uh, be great. He goes, uh, and sure enough, how about we call it the jungle junkie? And I said, that's awesome. I can't tell people that I named it. It was Dave that changed the name on it and managed, uh, a wildfire fly. Uh, Yellow Dog says it's one of their top, uh, South America flies that they sell.

Marvin Cash: That's super cool. So what was kind of stepping back a little bit, what's that normal kind of Umpqua selection process for, uh, what's it like?

Steve Maldonado: It's tough. I mean, uh, it is tough. Um, yeah, it's so tough, to say the least. I mean, the best hires in the country are on this thing, and it's, ah. And actually, the guys that pushed me towards this was Rick and Phil. They were. Rick was the, probably the biggest pusher of it. One, uh, of the fly tying in shows. And I had this that, very fly. And, uh, when I showed it to him, he goes, what? Oh, because you got a niche. He goes, nobody ties flies like this around here because it's all tiny stuff. And I said, he goes, you need to go find Dave and show him that fly. And, um, I said, who? And, uh, I went to meet him and then went through the process, but, uh, I mean, it's just me and Phil always joke about getting through, uh, Dave Student going through the gauntlet. We called it going through the gauntlet. You made it through him. And the fly was perfect. Not that they're not now, but I mean, he was tough. And then you got the whole process of the committee. Most are on the, you know, us fly fishing team, Josh Graf and Russ Miller. And there's just a bunch more. It's just really tough, you know, it's. And what people don't realize is just because you have a fly in the catalog doesn't mean you're a shoe in. I mean, I, me as well as a bunch of other people have, you know, you take the, you know, you're an Umpqua hot shot, and you're going in there going, hey, I got another fly to submit. And they just, we don't like that one. And you're like, what? So it's, it's tough.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And so, you know, for, uh, tyers, uh, that aspire to have Umpqua or another shop pick up their, their flies to produce. Do you have any tips for them?

Steve Maldonado: Uh, yeah, yeah. I mean, it's , um, number, one would be just open up your imagination and stick to your guns and sit there at the vice with the bear hook on there and just, just think about. Just open up your imagine. Put your imagination and put it on the hook. And, um, you know, that's number one. Uh, number two would be tie. Ah, a lot tie every day, if you can. Even if it's just a little fly. Uh, um, you know, just tie a lot and refine your techniques. Uh, with, uh, you know, thing I got from Kelly, you know, is your thread pressure. Your thread pressure is the number one priority to make everything perfect. Uh, that, that to me, trumps everything, is thread pressure. You know, keep um, an eye on that. Uh, and number three would be fish them a lot. You know, uh, like I said, do some, you know, some bank trimming weekend, take some scissors with you and, you know, I'm talking streamers, you know, and fish them a lot. And I mean, fish a lot. And sometimes you don't have to be fishing for a fish. Just don't, you know, see where you can, how you retrieve that fly. And if it's doing, you know, not kind of what you want it to do, it's got to do exactly what you want it to do. Uh, and, you know, that's a recommendation. And I just tell people, I mean, if you stop at any point and say, oh, man, that's close enough for me. It ain't good enough for Umpqua, well, I'll tell you that right now, it's got to be right. And it's got to be exactly like you make it. You want it to be.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, because they've got some serious anglers are going to go out and fish those flies, right?

Steve Maldonado: Oh, unbelievable. Unbelievable.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And so if we come down to, you know, down, down from Mount Olympus down to where all the mere mortal fly tires live, um, I always like to ask you to people like you and Phil and people that production tie, you know, if you have like three tying tips that you can share, you know, again with us mere mortal tires, that can kind of help us, you know, make our life at the vice a little bit better.

Steve Maldonado: Um, just, um, I mean, three tips to make you a better tire.

Marvin Cash: Yep.

Steve Maldonado: Um, tie something every day if you possibly can. I mean, it's, um, and, and don't get to, um, don't get too sucked in the rabbit hole, um, with, you know, a bunch of, uh, you know, techniques and watching, you know, just, there's so much stuff you can watch and so many guys you can watch. Uh, like the list that I gave out that I follow. And, I mean, just get a little bit from each of them and uh, make your own way. Uh, it's just, uh, you know, that's, that's another one. And just have confidence in what you're doing. I mean, just, uh, and don't give up and just, just, you know, get better at it and just, that's it.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. How about, um, so I know you do a lot with, like, deer, uh, hair and things like that. Any tips for, like, handling hair, um, that you can give folks?

Steve Maldonado: Uh, get good thread. Uh, you know, it's a, you know, just get strong thread and make sure that you clean your hair. I mean, it's just you can't clean it enough. Uh, there's always an under fur, you know, this just, you can't get it completely clean. Um, and I don't really spin my hair at all. Um, it's a, I get just a gigantic clump. And uh, um, I just, I just, I stack, kind of stack it, but I stack it around the whole hook and, and then I'll make three wraps and I'll just, you know, pull it tight. And uh, it, to me it works a lot better. I tie a lot of mice, you know, uh, like we talked about the night fishing. I mean, I tie a lot of mice with caribou hair. And, uh, uh, that works better than spinning. It's more consistent. Uh, when you do that, learn how to do that. Um, and, and it's uh, uh, it's, it's easier and it's way more consistent.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And then in terms of like, you know, uh, like dubbing, are you, you know, I know you mentioned that, uh, like laser dub was too short, right, for the jungle junkie.

Steve Maldonado: Yeah.

Marvin Cash: Uh, are you, are you spinning noodles or are you doing dubbing loops?

Steve Maldonado: Uh, I do, I do dubbing loops.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, got it. Uh, anything you want to share with folks there?

Steve Maldonado: Yeah, don't make them too long. You can make a loop way too long and it just, you, and there again, that goes back to your thread control. You um, can always put another one on there. Uh, so don't try to get everything on at once. Uh, if you can't handle the, you know, the thread pressure, um, where it's the same, make it, make a short loop. And a lot of times all you need is a short loop. Uh, and just make sure you're, as you're wrapping around and, and you're preening everything back. Just make sure your thread pressure stays the same all the way around there because you don't want to have a, you know, a couple of wraps of tight thread and then you got three or four of loose thread and then tight thread because uh, a tooth will get in there and uh, it's over.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. It'll become loose and broken thread.

Steve Maldonado: Absolutely.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. So, you know, you know, doing the dubbing noodles, have you ever, I mean, do you venture into kind of brush land or have you kind of stayed out of the brush world?

Steve Maldonado: No, uh, I use some brushes. I mean, the brushes are kind of cool. And, and I have a uh, little Stonfo, uh, turbo twister. I make a lot of my own brushes, especially for the big pike flies because I can, I can get these things that just look nasty and, uh, you can't buy it. You can't buy those kind of brushes, uh, that you can create on your own. And, uh, um, you know, that's just. I really do like making my own.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, it's funny you say that. That reminds me of seeing, uh, David from Squimpish flies in Edison making brushes. And that was a pretty amazing thing to watch.

Steve Maldonado: Oh, yeah. Yeah. Because you look at it, you're like, man, you can't even buy nothing like that. You can't. Yeah.

Marvin Cash: And I mean, that whole, you know, to me, I think that makes me think about Bob Popovics and, you know, him solving that size mass problem in fly fishing and it's just amazing. Like beast flies and stuff like that.

Steve Maldonado: Oh, yeah, yeah. It's pretty amazing.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. So, uh, I know you're a tinkerer, right? And so I. And so I know, like people that tie a lot, they're always playing around. Like they've either found a material that they're experimenting with, uh, or they're trying to figure out a new way to glue their fingers together with the latest resin. Um. What are you playing around with on your time bench right now?

Steve Maldonado: Uh, right now. SemperFli came out with some new stuff. It's uh, just, well, they have a whole bunch of new. Their stuff is so amazing. Uh, they got a bunch of new stuff they come out with for. I'm messing around with streamers. Um. Um, with some, just some of their dubbing that's like crazy long. And um, uh, some of their chenille that's just. The colors is just crazy. And they have so many different lengths of it. Um, so I'm messing around with that right now. And uh, it's been working pretty good. Uh, I'm working on a new top water frog, uh, for bass. Uh, I can get over to Texas and, uh, hit the lily pads and fish around that thick hydrilla. And, uh, it's going to be weedless and it's articulated.

Marvin Cash: Oh, there you go.

Steve Maldonado: Yeah.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. That's funny because I was uh, I was talking to some guys from, uh, Rather Outdoors when we were flying back from ICAST. And you know, they were uh, I was like the space alien, right? Because I was a fly fisherman. And so, uh, you know, I was telling them that there are some instances where the fly rod is a better tool. And to me, fishing lily pads is one of those.

Steve Maldonado: Oh, it's hands down awesome.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. You know, and I just like. And they're like, well, why is that I was like, well, guys, because you don't have to bring everything back to the boat. Every time, I was like, dude, when you're done, just lift it and put it back.

Steve Maldonado: Yeah, yeah. It's, uh, you know, and then with, you know, like I said with that. With that technique I use for the streamers here, for trout. I mean, it's the same thing, you know, I would do, you know, with the frog, uh, you know, on a bait caster. And you get that rod down and you just pop it. You can zip it between lily pads. Pop it on another one. Zip it off, pop it on another one. Uh, you know, you try doing the strip, strip, strip. That ain't gonna work. I've tried it.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, you might make a salad.

Steve Maldonado: Uh, yeah.

Marvin Cash: The. So the other thing I like to ask super, uh, avid tires is, you know, I bet you that you have some super oddball tool that you may have even made yourself that you can't live without.

Steve Maldonado: I can even, without a doubt, tell you that's that stupid finger brush I have.

Marvin Cash: Is it a, is it a cat brush? Is that what that is?

Steve Maldonado: No, it's like, uh, Enrico Puglisi. It's like a. It looks like a dog brush, but it's just big enough to, you can put your finger in it, and, uh, it's just for brushing out streamers and brushing out dubbing and care or whatever that little finger brush is. Just, uh. Uh, yeah, I mean, it's, uh. It's funny. It's a. They ever making the luck with tie?

Marvin Cash: Yeah, it's funny. So you're the second person probably within the last two months that had mentioned that as their favorite tool. Um, Adam. Adam Hortenberry, I, uh, interviewed him, uh, to help him promote his flytime event, the Rhode Island Fly Bash. And, um.

Steve Maldonado: Oh, yeah, yeah.

Marvin Cash: That's his favorite tool. And I think. You know what I think it is? I think it's a. It's a cat brush.

Steve Maldonado: Yeah. And it's. It looks like a cat brush. It's just, you can put. You can put it on your, you know, your finger, index finger, middle finger, wherever, and just, uh, it does the best job for brushing, brushing, dubbing out. It's just ridiculous.

Marvin Cash: Oh, well, there you go, folks. And, you know, so I know you're chasing tarpon. You know, you've been down in South America, Central America. You know, do you have any kind of travel or hosted trips you want to share with our listeners?

Steve Maldonado: Yeah, you know, it's a, uh. I got some open spots. You know, if anybody's interested. I'm hosting a trip with, uh, to Brazil, you know, uh, on Rio de Lua, uh, October 18 through the 27th with Nomadic Waters and Michael Williams. And let me tell you what, what a great organization. Uh, Michael's just top notch. His guides are, uh, you know, when I went over there with Pat, I mean, these guys are the best in the business for doing what they do. And, and Michael's operation with the cooks and the way you get treated is, and the equipment is, uh, you know, talking boat stuff because, you know, you're taking your own fly, but they supply stuff if you don't have them. And, and there are people out there that don't fly fish and say, mean, I want to give that a shot. They got spinning reels, um, and all the, all the hard baits and, you know, sassy shad, whatever it is they have. Uh, uh, but it's, it's a top notch and it's unbelievable. Uh, the five days we were there, uh, there was, I think, six of us fishing. And they, they keep their little baseball clicker. Cause they, they get back to the main boat and they argue about who's the best guide. And it's funny. They're just like us. You just can't understand them. It's, it's hilarious. And, uh, I think we landed, uh, over 3000 fish in five days.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, it's interesting, too. Um, and Michael does a great job. And I think the great thing, you know, it starts with great people, right?

Steve Maldonado: It does, it does.

Marvin Cash: You know, Mike, uh, it does. You know, Michael and his US team are great. The people he has down there are great. But I also would say, you know, his approach makes fishing in a very inhospitable place very comfortable with the houseboat and kind of running off the boat.

Steve Maldonado: Very comfortable, and, uh, it's like I said, if anybody wants to get ahold of me on that, I got spots open. Uh, we're only taking eight people on this trip I'm hosting, so it's not going to be a boat full of people. Um, I said I got a few spots if you're interested. Get a hold of me and, uh, grab a ten weight and it's on.

Marvin Cash: There you go. And, uh, is there anything else, Steve, before I let you go to get to your green chilies, because I know you told me, I know one thing that you should tell me about is your trip to Ireland. But is there anything else?

Steve Maldonado: Oh, yeah. Well, you know, just, uh, I mean, the basic, you know, stuff that this I tell, uh, um, uh, you know, people to get better, just, you know, start fishing a lot and tie more and, you know, and really go out and try to, you know, dissect your river, your lake, or wherever it is you're fishing. And, uh, um, you know, it's just, um, you'll know when you arrive, when you really start, you know, getting, uh, to the point where, uh, you know, you're going to try to find the fish that doesn't want to be found, and then, you know, get your ability to the point where you can catch the fish that doesn't want to be caught. And that's just, um, one of the things, and, you know, one of the things I always tell people at my seminars, uh, when I do the tying demos or, you know, wherever I go, and I get up there and, and, uh, I tell people getting bites builds confidence, and confidence builds more bites. And that's what it's all about, you know, find your confidence streamer, settle down, and fish it. And every time you go to the river, you're going to get a little bit better. Um, and don't be afraid to switch it up, you know, and vary your retrieves. Clear water versus dirty water, high water, low water, you know, find out what they want, feed it to them, and, you know, just find yourself a simple system and make it work for you. And, you know, I always tell people at the last, you know, last part of that, and I said, don't use your line to move the fly.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, those can be fighting words in some parts. But when do you head across the pond and go to Ireland? You were invited, uh, to go tie, was it the English Fly Tying Fair?

Steve Maldonado: Yeah, the Irish Fly Fest, which is, uh, in Northern Ireland, and that is, uh, the middle of November, where we're flying into Dublin. Tammy's going with me, and, uh, we're going to rent a car, and I made sure they gave me one with the steering wheel on the right side and, which had to pay extra for, so it was. I didn't care to. And, uh, uh, we're going to drive into Northern Ireland. It's about a two and a half hour drive. And, uh, it's not just a few Americans ever get invited to this. And, uh, I, um, didn't think I had what flies they, I'm thinking, what am I going to tie up there? Well, they want me to tie my streamers, and that's why I got invited.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. They want pike flies, right?

Steve Maldonado: Yep. They want some pike stuff. Big stuff.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And so have you started to kind of, uh, pencil in your 2025 show season. So if people want to come and kind of hang out with you, because you'll be sitting next to Phil and Rick will be sitting on the other side of Phil, right?

Steve Maldonado: Oh, God, yeah. Yeah. It's a, uh, I mean, Denver show for sure. And we talked. I'm going to do Atlanta. Ah. And, uh, um, I can't do the, uh, symposium because I think that's the same time I'll be in Ireland. And, uh, I'm going to try to hit a bunch of them. Ah. You know, just, uh, I do the salvo ground up. I'm going to go. I get invited every year to do the streamer love fest. So that's, that's a blast. Hopefully, uh, I make it up to the box guard this year. If I get a, you know, get a shot for that and, uh, that'll be awesome. Uh, but I'll hit, you know, uh, um, just, um, a bunch of shows. I'm going to try to hit a bunch and, you know, hook up with Landon and it's, uh, I get, you know, it's such a deal. You know, the rental car was with my Southwest deal, and it's, uh, it's nice to hanging around Landon. I'm going to go to Virginia again to that, and I'll go back to Texas. Uh, new brunt. That show was phenomenal. I'll be back down there to that. Uh, so there, there's quite a bit. I'll make sure I post a bunch of them on my website. I'm going to try to hit a bunch of them.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, that sounds cool. You have to come hang out in Atlanta in the articulate fly hospitality suite. There's always, uh, you know, goodies and ample alcohol.

Steve Maldonado: Absolutely.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And so, you know, we didn't touch on this, but you actually will tie fly, uh, custom fly orders for folks. If folks want to get some flies from you, what should they do?

Steve Maldonado: Just, uh, you can contact me on Instagram. Uh, you know, it's maldo_goosekilla67 Facebook. Uh, just get on my name, send me a personal message, and, uh, um, I'll tell you whatever you want. Um, and I'll won't change what you want or try to explain to you something different that I like, and I'll tie them exactly like you want them. Uh, and, uh, just, you know, any colors you want, any style you want, doesn't, uh, have to be streamers or whatever it is, I'll tie it for you and just get ahold of me.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And just because you know, sometimes fishermen are not great planners. Um, what's the lead time on your custom fly orders generally?

Steve Maldonado: Uh, if you put in. If you was to. What's today, Thursday?

Marvin Cash: Yep.

Steve Maldonado: If you put in. If you put in an order today on a few dozen, uh, maybe even the streamers. Uh, I'll m have them to you by next. By this coming Friday.

Marvin Cash: Well, there you go. Yeah, that's that. Great. You, uh, you've worked those double shifts at the airport, so you got a bunch of days stacked off, right?

Steve Maldonado: Yeah, well, you know, I take my stuff over there and I tie there, too.

Marvin Cash: Oh, which, which I forgot to ask you, what's your favorite glue for gluing on, uh, door plugs? Uh, uh, on airplanes?

Steve Maldonado: Oh, it's just Elmers.

Marvin Cash: Well, there you go.

Steve Maldonado: I think we have a problem with those because we're using wood glue, and I think. I don't think the metal is attached.

Marvin Cash: Oh, you didn't do the glue joint where you put glue on both ends and let it dry and then glued it again?

Steve Maldonado: No.

Marvin Cash: Oh, man. But just for the record, you guys don't have any of those airplanes in your fleet, right?

Steve Maldonado: We do not, no.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, I didn't think you had any Boeings. Um, but, nope. Lord knows, United does. Uh.

Steve Maldonado: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Marvin Cash: So, uh, well, that's funny. And so, you know, back, uh, to get a little bit more serious before we go, you know, what's the best way for folks to follow your adventures at the vise and on the water and in the, in the field? Because you hunt elk, right?

Steve Maldonado: Oh, yeah, yeah, I do. Uh, I mean, just follow me on Instagram, except that's where I post everything. Uh, I got a lot of, uh, in YouTube, but, you know, I got a lot of, uh, videos in the works. Matter of fact, I, uh, editing some stuff, and I'm gonna. I'm gonna plaster a whole bunch of, uh, videos coming up here in about two weeks, uh, uh, on just techniques and just, you know, how to put the eyes on and all that stuff.

Marvin Cash: Well, there you go. And, you know, I will drop all that stuff, Steve, for you in the show notes. And, um, I don't want to keep. I don't want to keep you from dinner, but I really appreciate you hanging out with me a little bit tonight.

Steve Maldonado: No, thank you, Marvin. It's been a pleasure. I always enjoy talking with you, hanging out with you when I see you. And, uh, you got a great show, and, uh, I appreciate you even asking me to be on it. I'm honored. I am. Thank you.

Marvin Cash: Oh, I'm honored. To have you. And we got to, uh, we got to, you know, when we're done with the interview, we got to get the, uh, Eastern style, uh, North Carolina style barbecue cook off, uh, calendered up, too.

Steve Maldonado: Absolutely, absolutely. And I'll keep in touch with you.

Marvin Cash: You bet. Take care. Well, folks, we hope you enjoyed the interview as much as we enjoyed bringing it to you. Don't forget to check out Trout Routes Pro at maps.troutroutes.com. use artfly20 all one word artfly20 to get 20% off your membership. Tight lines, everybody.